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best Frame work or Most Popular Frame woork ?
Posted: Tue Jun 20, 2006 2:44 am
by saumya
hi guys,
Can you tell me which is most popular frame work for PHP Development Or to make the question into two folds, which is the best Framework for PHP development?
Re: best Frame work or Most Popular Frame woork ?
Posted: Tue Jun 20, 2006 8:18 am
by Roja
saumya wrote:Can you tell me which is most popular frame work for PHP Development Or to make the question into two folds, which is the best Framework for PHP development?
Most popular is hard to gauge. I'd probably say Zend's Framework. If not already the most popular, it will be in the near future.
Which is best is much easier. Whichever one you feel most comfortable with. If you don't understand a framework, you shouldnt be using it.
Posted: Tue Jun 20, 2006 9:16 am
by Luke
anybody have any thing to say about the cakephp framework? I was going to start a thread about it, but this seems like an appropriate place to ask. (Sorry OP)
Posted: Tue Jun 20, 2006 11:20 am
by santosj
The comment about the
Zend Framework gaining popularity after it is finished it true. The Filter and InputFilter alone make it worth considering and if nothing else used in every project.
If it was finished!
I have heard some hype about
EZ Components, but I'm not impressed. Not an accurate representation since I have never used it. Just looked at the documentation and said, "Worthless!" It doesn't match my needs, but it look inviting if I was doing PHP professionally and didn't want to reinvent the wheel by creating a caching component. Not everything in EZ Components is interesting, but you would most likely only use those that you needed.
Both Framework Licenses shouldn't restrict anyone from using them, so I see both gaining both popularity and becoming the 'best' framework. I can see myself using a component or two of both frameworks in the future. I'll still be shy of Zend Framework until it reaches either a complete Filter component or is finalized.
As for the Filter, there is development of filter functions in I guess PHP 6 that won't replace the objects, but should complement them nicely.
The Ninja Space Goat wrote:anybody have any thing to say about the cakephp framework? I was going to start a thread about it, but this seems like an appropriate place to ask. (Sorry OP)
No. cakePHP should use a component system like both Zend Framework and Ez Components. Building on top of cakePHP does seem interesting and would restrict to a set design for developers, but I would rather like to have it in a separated model where I only use what I need and nothing more.
EDIT
Okay, technically cakePHP IS a component system, however you are still required to have model, view, and controller folders and files. It is billed as a PHP Rails, but Rails is actually based off of PHP, so I still don't see a point of this. Forcing developers to MVC model is not a good thing in my opinion. New coders won't be able to get into it and not all projects would work well with the model.
If you want Ruby class support, then learn and use Ruby on Rails. If you are going to use PHP, then use PHP.
Posted: Tue Jun 20, 2006 11:35 am
by saumya
hi guys,
thank you so much.But I have heard about ATK often.Though not very often, but often I come across.How do you feel about that? Well, one more come here again is WASP.But As you have already mentioned, I am also thinking that ZEND is going to be in.But that only we can confirm after their final release.
thanking you
saumya
Posted: Tue Jun 20, 2006 2:32 pm
by John Cartwright
The Ninja Space Goat wrote:anybody have any thing to say about the cakephp framework? I was going to start a thread about it, but this seems like an appropriate place to ask. (Sorry OP)
My last contract I used CakePHP.. aside from their slightly lacking documentation I found framework very pleasent and feature rich. I will likely be sticking with CakePHP until the completetion of Zend Framework (which is expected to be released sometime next year -- I believe).. because ZF is still lacking some key features.
Posted: Tue Jun 20, 2006 2:58 pm
by Luke
Jcart wrote:because ZF is still lacking some key features.
such as?
Posted: Tue Jun 20, 2006 3:04 pm
by John Cartwright
The Ninja Space Goat wrote:Jcart wrote:because ZF is still lacking some key features.
such as?
For one a stable Zend_DB.. considering they don't even recommend using it within their own applications at the moment (there are several known issues). Another being user permission.. and I don't even know if they plan on implementing this out of the box or if it's going to be an add-on solutions. I believe from reading their mailing list awhiles back that they were sort of pushing for the latter.. not sure on this one though. Another one being a unified configuration system.. there is a lot of features to come that just havn't been implemented yet. Have a crawl through the
mailing list and check out all the proposals
Edit | I just noticed they have a new section up for
proposals in their wiki
Posted: Tue Jun 20, 2006 3:10 pm
by Luke
I'm kind of torn between creating my own framework with pieces of code I have gathered over time, or using cakePHP or Zend even though it's not complete. I like the idea of using a framework that is already built because it has documentation, and it's tried and true, but then again I like the idea of building my own, because it will then only have the features I need and I will be completely comfortable using it.
Jcart - you are one of the few people on this site who say they use (or have used) any type of framework. I am interested in hearing your opinion.
Posted: Tue Jun 20, 2006 3:16 pm
by John Cartwright
It depends where you stand, are you looking for the best possible solution or to learn a heckavalot in making one on your own. When I created a framework when trying to learn OOP, it was a great experience and the experience gained was invaluable. Although when I come to professional contracts or whatnot, I will typically create an application based on a highly documented and tested system simply because it is tried an true, and if I have a problem with the code base there is likely always somewhere out there to help you.
If you want my true opinion, I would push to first try and create your own from scratch to fully appreciate the value of a framework. Take a look at the most popular frameworks, and find out what you don't like about them, and from there try and improve upon those lacking features within your own framework.
Posted: Tue Jun 20, 2006 3:23 pm
by Luke
Jcart wrote:It depends where you stand, are you looking for the best possible solution or to learn a heckavalot in making one on your own. When I created a framework when trying to learn OOP, it was a great experience and the experience gained was invaluable. Although when I come to professional contracts or whatnot, I will typically create an application based on a highly documented and tested system simply because it is tried an true, and if I have a problem with the code base there is likely always somewhere out there to help you.
If you want my true opinion, I would push to first try and create your own from scratch to fully appreciate the value of a framework. Take a look at the most popular frameworks, and find out what you don't like about them, and from there try and improve upon those lacking features within your own framework.
I completely agree with you about the learning aspect, but...
I am going to be using this framework to develop a dozen or more applications that will be accessible by a client control panel (also built with the framework). All modules (and even control panel) will need updates all the time. My problem is that some day, I will probably want to move from my custom framework to cake or ZF (because of the tried-and-true factor as well as the fact that I am just in no way compareable to a team of developers) and it will be INSANELY difficult to do so.
I like the idea of being able to update my framework without worry of breaking things (which is not guaranteed if I build it

). I would REALLY like to work with the Zend framework because it is Zend, and it seems to be on the right path, but like you said it's not finished. Maybe I will use this framework with my own code filling in where it lacks, and then come back and update when it is finished.
EDIT: I just found a kind of cool page that compares a number of frameworks side-by-side if anybody's interested:
http://www.phpit.net/article/ten-differ ... rameworks/
Posted: Tue Jun 20, 2006 8:59 pm
by saumya
wow.
from that link,we got to know that the clear winner is CakePHP.But "Seagull Framework" seems to have everything in it !!

Posted: Tue Jun 20, 2006 9:34 pm
by Luke
saumya wrote:wow.
from that link,we got to know that the clear winner is CakePHP.But "Seagull Framework" seems to have everything in it !!

So does cakePHP... that list is inaccurate. I posted it before really researching it. cakePHP has everything on that list.
Posted: Tue Jun 20, 2006 11:06 pm
by Robert Plank
Dang it... I would jump on cakePHP if it weren't for the mod_rewrite stuff.
Posted: Tue Jun 20, 2006 11:09 pm
by Luke
Robert Plank wrote:Dang it... I would jump on cakePHP if it weren't for the mod_rewrite stuff.
I know very little about mod_rewrite, but it has already caused problems... what are your greivances with it?