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Help >> IP protected poll

Posted: Sat Jul 12, 2008 9:45 am
by Monopoly
I hope I won't have you all tossing stones at me ... :oops:

Well , I made a simple poll that is "protected" (whether it really is) from multiple votes by saving the client's IP address in a mysql table [ it is varchar(65) ],

While testing it , I encountered that multiple votes slip from the same machine ! It was actually me tried it out ...
A vote from the same machine is being submitted after 3-4 sessions , at the same poll though a set an IP Protection :crazy:


Is there a way to protect from these proxy things or whatever the probelm is :?: :?: :?: :?: ...

Re: Help >> IP protected poll

Posted: Sat Jul 12, 2008 10:58 am
by Apollo
If you see your own votes (all from the same IP) then there's obviously a bug in your code.

But if you're asking if can you protect your poll against cheaters using proxies and stuff: no, you can't. You can make things a little bit harder for them by also storing cookies, comparing agent identifiers etc. Might help to filter out the retards. But no matter what trickery you use, people will always be able to cast multiple votes.

Re: Help >> IP protected poll

Posted: Sat Jul 12, 2008 11:30 am
by Eran
Also keep in mind that most people don't have static IPs. People using a dialer will get reassigned an IP on each connection, and even persistent connections' IP get reset every 3 days.

Re: Help >> IP protected poll

Posted: Sat Jul 12, 2008 3:53 pm
by alex.barylski
^^^ While I agree with everything you said...I'm not so sure I would say *most* people don't have static IP's

Maybe I'm wrong (I think China actually just recently surpassed the USA in Internet users) but in Canada I would say 85-90% of Internet users are on Broadband. Only older population (like my uncle) can even bare with dialup anymore. Personally I've had high speed internet for almost 10 years (ie: static IP).

To answer the question of the OP with two options:

1. Use captcha to prevent automated voting. That is a huge problem otherwise.
2. Use an authentication system as well to ensure that one vote per user is enforced

Re: Help >> IP protected poll

Posted: Sat Jul 12, 2008 3:56 pm
by Eran
Broadband != static IP, I don't know where you got that perception... Also, I was speaking only of broadband. Some connections use a dialer connected to a LAN modem, not a dial-up modem of old. I know in my country (Israel) over 95% of internet connections are broadband, yet you have to pay extra if you want a static IP (most people don't need it).

Re: Help >> IP protected poll

Posted: Sat Jul 12, 2008 4:18 pm
by alex.barylski
Broadband != static IP, I don't know where you got that perception
Mostly because you noted that people using dialup will be re-assigned new IP's. My IP changes so infrequently with my high speed cable...it was safe me to to assume broadband = static IP. At least in the sense that it doesn't change each time you login.

I'm not sure how it works with DSL but Cable has offered a fairly static IP address.

Re: Help >> IP protected poll

Posted: Sat Jul 12, 2008 4:43 pm
by Eran
people using dialup
I said dialers, not dial-up. A dialer is a program provided by a service provider to connect to their network without configuring the connection yourself. It is very common here for broadband connections. I've reiterated that in my last response.. and by the way I'm connected via cables and had no permanent IP until I specifically requested it.

Re: Help >> IP protected poll

Posted: Sat Jul 12, 2008 6:37 pm
by alex.barylski
A dialer is a program provided by a service provider to connect to their network without configuring the connection yourself. It is very common here for broadband connections.
My friends who have DSL need a third party program installed inorder to access the internet. I have cable and have never had anything else...so all I do is plug into the wall and voila.

I'm pretty sure we need to explicitly request a IP change...if one is desired...even then they usually recommend a proxy first. About the only time the IP's change is when the system goes down on their part and we have to reboot the router then occasionally we get assigned a new IP.

Re: Help >> IP protected poll

Posted: Mon Jul 14, 2008 8:56 am
by webaddict
Hockey wrote:My friends who have DSL need a third party program installed inorder to access the internet. I have cable and have never had anything else...so all I do is plug into the wall and voila.
DSL and cable are really pretty much alike. There is no need for software to get a DSL connection, other than the firmware that is in the broadbandrouter and the settings thereof.
Hockey wrote:I'm pretty sure we need to explicitly request a IP change...if one is desired...even then they usually recommend a proxy first. About the only time the IP's change is when the system goes down on their part and we have to reboot the router then occasionally we get assigned a new IP.
Both my DSL connection as my cable connection have static IP addresses. Reason for this is that they're both corporate connections, which means I am allowed to install and maintain a webserver or mailserver on such a connection. Nontheless, having a broadband connection does not guaranty a static IP address. In the Netherlands having a dynamic IP address on a "personal" broadband connection is common, not a static one. It's all up to your Access Provider, really.

Now, getting back at the topicstart: no, there is no decent way to make sure every single person can vote only once, other than using user/pass combinations. The problem is that the other factors aren't stable, nor secure nor unique.

Re: Help >> IP protected poll

Posted: Thu Jul 17, 2008 1:38 pm
by Mordred
Monopoly wrote:saving the client's IP address in a mysql table [ it is varchar(65) ]
The currently used IP protocol uses 4 byte IP addresses. char(4) is enough if you use ip2long(). Even the textual representation of an IP is at most 15 characters - 4x3 digits + 3 dots.

65 is ... just too much. :crazy: