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Posted: Sun Aug 24, 2003 3:40 pm
by Jade
Okay, i think i'm getting the point. Now i have one more topic to throw out at you guys (and thankfully girls). I heard recently that I might have a problem going into programing because 20 years down the road the USA will have all its programing done by the Japanese cause its cheaper. Is there any truth in this would-be rumor??

BTW: I'm 17, work for myself and live out in the country surrounded by horses. My site is http://www.whiteoakstables.net where i make about $500 a month...not bad if i do say so myself.

Jade

Posted: Sun Aug 24, 2003 4:02 pm
by phice
I'm 17 as well, and I've had clients that have nearly laughed because of my age. Then I laugh a few days later because they paid for something I do every day. 8)

Posted: Sun Aug 24, 2003 5:00 pm
by nielsene
Jade wrote:Okay, i think i'm getting the point. Now i have one more topic to throw out at you guys (and thankfully girls). I heard recently that I might have a problem going into programing because 20 years down the road the USA will have all its programing done by the Japanese cause its cheaper. Is there any truth in this would-be rumor??
Jade
Yes a lot of programming tasks are going off-shore, mainly to Eastern Europe or India. (I doubt Japan is getting much of the business, their cost of living tendsto be even higher than the US).

However, there will always be a need for good local programmers too. Its is going to cut down on the number of programming jobs availible, and will probably lower the salary some as well. However, I think it will end up raising the quality of programmers in the States. The extreme of number of "get-rich quick" programmers of the late 90s saturated the market with people who didn't really care about programmer or enjoy it. Now that the money isn't there to the same degree, the people who enjoy it can still make a living, but its not as attractive to people just looking for a quick buck.

Programming will still be a job that can command a respectable salary, but you'll have to know your stuff and preform well. (But that's really true of any skilled job.)

Posted: Sun Aug 24, 2003 5:50 pm
by trollll
I completed agree with nielsene on this one. The economy sucks and companies large and small plan on (or have started) hiring overseas to cut costs. However we all hope that they realize very shortly that doing things that way will really dump the economy further into ruin (true for U.S., U.K., etc.).

Living in the middle of nowhere has its advantages and disadvantages when looking for this type of work at a young age. Hopefully if you have to interview face-to-face you interview with a developer who can see that you know your stuff rather than a manager who (and let's give managers the credit they deserve) will tend to look at petty crap like your sex, age and how many useless acronyms you know.

I don't know VA well enough to give you much advice, but as far as areas I have dealt with, they've varied incredibly in my reception at interviews... Age 18 in San Francisco - high school drop-out with no college or formal experience worked contract to perm as web developer. Age 19 in Los Angeles - laughed at and insulted to my face. Age 20 in San Francisco after the bubble burst - government contract. Now 21 and working a major contract for IBM and another which I should really get back to working on...

As nielsene said, just know your stuff and do it well. Build up a list of happy customers and few people can argue that you don't have the ability to do something.

Programming

Posted: Mon Aug 25, 2003 10:00 pm
by daniworldwide
I hope programming pay won't go down too much, because thats the area I would like to work in. I certainly do not want to travel too much for business, thats what my father does. Currently he's in Singapore for 2 weeks. I like to stay in one place, know my surroundings. I'd die travelling almost every week. I hope the programming business still is a good area to work in in 10 years.

-Dani

Posted: Fri Aug 29, 2003 10:44 am
by evilmonkey
I hate to burst a bubble of a few young programmers here, but according to the exprets, the outlook on programming for the future is not that great. Don't get me wrong, as long as the technology exists, there will need to be people to maintain and improve it. However, if you live in North America or Western Europe, I would urge to take a look at how many programmers got layed off in the last three years. Programming became very overblown (like someone said, people were using it as a get rich quick scheme), and you know what happens when something gets overblown: it bursts. That's what happenned. If programming was "the field" in the late 70s to the late 90s, Biotechnology is the new field. Analysts predict a sharp increase in the need for biotechnology, pharmaceuticals, and other medicines. It makes sense too, the population with the most money is soon going into retirement, and will soon require the technology to extend thier lives.

Once again, don't get me wrong. I'm not saying don't go into programming. However, if you do, you better know what you're doing, because bieng good is not good enough, you have to be the best.

Cheers!

Posted: Wed Sep 03, 2003 5:45 pm
by RobertStout
I've heard the same thing Mr. evilmonkey.

However so long as there are computers there will be a need for software, and so long as their is a need for software there is a need for us.

I could not be anything but a programmer. So I will go down bravely with the ship if it sinks.

*salutes*

Posted: Thu Sep 04, 2003 8:55 pm
by evilmonkey
And i salute your Robert!

Like I said, only the best will make it. If you are the best, the it's a green light for you, my friend. If you are not the best, you will have a tough time getting a job. Like I said, analysts are predicting a huge increase in the need for biotechnology, biochemistry, and bioengineering. All of this needs programming, so there is a shot for programers still. The ship is not sunk.

Posted: Fri Sep 05, 2003 11:16 am
by RobertStout
So long as I get to code on good software I'll be happy.

I'm a smart fella and once I get this programming gig firmly under my belt (or atleast where it doesnt slip out and crush my toes) I may take up bio*.

Posted: Fri Sep 05, 2003 1:22 pm
by xisle
Yes, as the global economy grows, entry level programming jobs will move overseas, exactly as the shoe, steel and clothing manufacturers have done so over the past decade. I read that India is currently producing approx. 200,000 computer science graduates a year, quite a few more than the US. And, many major players are moving jobs and opening offices there because the average progger salary is half what it is here in the states. What does it mean? Europe and the US will need to remain on the forefront of technology in the areas of aerospace, biotech, robotics, etc. Korea for example will continue to produce lower wage workers, regardless if the product is software, sneakers, or widgets.

travel

Posted: Fri Sep 05, 2003 4:04 pm
by daniworldwide
Is there any country other than the US that would have better pay than the US in programing? I want to move out of the US when I finish college, I can speak Spanish and German fluently, well Spanish almost fluently. I'd like to move to a country with those languages. :twisted: It'd be fun! :D But anyways, my passion is programing and foreign languages, and I'd like to mix the two, but how?

Posted: Fri Sep 05, 2003 6:29 pm
by evilmonkey
You can always program in a foriegn language. :lol: :roll:

Posted: Thu Sep 11, 2003 5:45 am
by Tubbietoeter
The job situation for programmers in Germany sucks. There just are no jobs.

It doesn't help being a good programmer and hard worker either, since someone is always better and faster. Unless your younger than 25 with job experience of 35 yrs, it looks quite bad ...

Being a woman doens't help you either.

My contract ends on 31.12.2003 ... my reference is really good and my boss is thrilled ... but that don't help me.

it can't be better here in germany than anywhere else ...