Page 2 of 3
Posted: Wed Nov 30, 2005 7:29 pm
by m3mn0n
Well there is also the open source element. And the community support that Firefox has with all the extensions and etc.
In that regard, Firefox still takes the cake.
Re: Best Browser
Posted: Wed Nov 30, 2005 7:53 pm
by Roja
AKA Panama Jack wrote:You might want to do a little checking into Firefox 1.5.

It's not 100% CSS2 compliant either.

I never said it did. You told foobar that Opera didn't have any issues with css, which was inaccurate. I corrected that.
AKA Panama Jack wrote:Opera is the only one that even comes close to passing the Acid2 test.
Safari already passed it. Firefox's changes for Acid2 are on the Moz-1.9 tree, not the Moz-1.8 tree (which was used to make Firefox-1.5). Its only three fixes behind Opera, which is two fixes away from compliance.
I keep up quite well.
AKA Panama Jack wrote:Honestly I haven't found an extention for Firefox that Opera either can't do already or would even need.
I have *11* installed, and many aren't available in any form on Opera. Since you've been a primary-Opera user for a long time, I'm not surprised that you haven't discovered all the great plugins there are.
AKA Panama Jack wrote:Oh, and Opera's Plugins can work just like Firefox's Extensions so there really isn't much difference there.
The difference is the selection. Most people are developing plugins/extensions for Firefox, not Opera. Its not even a close competition.
[update]
AKA Panama Jack wrote:
Might be because there are alot of security holes still in Firefox 1.5 and no date as to when they will be fixed.
Firefox fixes security issues faster than most vendors. But, don't forget to mention that Opera also has security issues, and no date for their fix:
http://secunia.com/product/4932/
Posted: Wed Nov 30, 2005 9:36 pm
by neophyte
FireFox and the Mozilla Suite is my favorite. I love the developer extensions for FF!
2nd favorites Konqueror and Opera
3rd favorite Safari
Crap List IE
Crappier List IE 5.2 on Mac
Posted: Thu Dec 01, 2005 6:33 am
by foobar
d11wtq wrote:The Ninja Space Goat wrote:Ree wrote:omg I see a vote for IE...
ew... gross!
It does have it's passionate users.... probably those that write client-side apps specific to MSIE using proprietary code

Spit that out, now! Don't let the evil of M$ proprietary "standards" be mentioned in any of our speech! Don't call the demon out of his den!

Re: Best Browser
Posted: Thu Dec 01, 2005 11:18 am
by Luke
Sami wrote:The Ninja Space Goat wrote:I just started using it today due to the fact that I am no longer allowed to use FF at work.
You know why they instilled that policy?
Because the boss is a Microsoft lover and he won't accept that any product not made by microsoft is a worthy product. And he cannot spy on me when I am in Firefox... he's got this spy program that will only work in IE.
Re: Best Browser
Posted: Thu Dec 01, 2005 11:21 am
by m3mn0n
The Ninja Space Goat wrote:Sami wrote:The Ninja Space Goat wrote:I just started using it today due to the fact that I am no longer allowed to use FF at work.
You know why they instilled that policy?
Because the boss is a Microsoft lover and he won't accept that any product not made by microsoft is a worthy product. And he cannot spy on me when I am in Firefox... he's got this spy program that will only work in IE.
ahh
I thought it would be something like that.
That sucks...
Re: Best Browser
Posted: Thu Dec 01, 2005 1:17 pm
by Deemo
The Ninja Space Goat wrote:Sami wrote:The Ninja Space Goat wrote:I just started using it today due to the fact that I am no longer allowed to use FF at work.
You know why they instilled that policy?
Because the boss is a Microsoft lover and he won't accept that any product not made by microsoft is a worthy product. And he cannot spy on me when I am in Firefox... he's got this spy program that will only work in IE.
just an idea that popped into my head. If you were to install the IEtab extension to firefox, and then use that most of the time, would he have a problem with it
its kinda pointless though just something funny you can present to him
Re: Best Browser
Posted: Thu Dec 01, 2005 2:01 pm
by foobar
The Ninja Space Goat wrote:Sami wrote:The Ninja Space Goat wrote:I just started using it today due to the fact that I am no longer allowed to use FF at work.
You know why they instilled that policy?
Because the boss is a Microsoft lover and he won't accept that any product not made by microsoft is a worthy product. And he cannot spy on me when I am in Firefox... he's got this spy program that will only work in IE.
Depending if your boss is a complete tool or not, you could look for an IE skin for Firefox (there are a few official ones on update.mozilla.com). If you're lucky, he wouldn't notice. Especially if you're using Windows XP.

Posted: Thu Dec 01, 2005 2:02 pm
by Deemo
i think the boss would notice him not being able to spy anymore though

Posted: Thu Dec 01, 2005 2:16 pm
by foobar
Deemo wrote:i think the boss would notice him not being able to spy anymore though

Hm...maybe he could program a little tool that would automatically browse to random websites with IE just so Big Brother is satisfied.

Posted: Thu Dec 01, 2005 5:38 pm
by Luke
foobar wrote:Deemo wrote:i think the boss would notice him not being able to spy anymore though

Hm...maybe he could program a little tool that would automatically browse to random websites with IE just so Big Brother is satisfied.

haha
Posted: Thu Dec 01, 2005 6:58 pm
by nigma
Posted: Thu Dec 01, 2005 6:59 pm
by Luke
Speak up IE lovers... who are you?
Re: Best Browser
Posted: Thu Dec 01, 2005 10:45 pm
by AKA Panama Jack
Roja wrote:AKA Panama Jack wrote:You might want to do a little checking into Firefox 1.5.

It's not 100% CSS2 compliant either.

I never said it did. You told foobar that Opera didn't have any issues with css, which was inaccurate. I corrected that.
No, you are putting words in my mouth. I never said it didn't have any issues. And you need to correct your reply if you don't want to want to seem... erm... nevermind. You IMPLIED that Firefox doesn't have CSS issues. Maybe if you had included in your reply that both Firefox and Opera have unique CSS issues.
Roja wrote:AKA Panama Jack wrote:Honestly I haven't found an extention for Firefox that Opera either can't do already or would even need.
I have *11* installed, and many aren't available in any form on Opera. Since you've been a primary-Opera user for a long time, I'm not surprised that you haven't discovered all the great plugins there are.
And that is 11 too many for a browser and I know what plugins are availible.
Roja wrote:AKA Panama Jack wrote:Oh, and Opera's Plugins can work just like Firefox's Extensions so there really isn't much difference there.
The difference is the selection. Most people are developing plugins/extensions for Firefox, not Opera. Its not even a close competition.
Many of the extentions that have been created for Firefox are not needed for Opera. In otherwords they are trying to duplicate through extentions many of the features that comes standard with Opera. The average user would find it more than a little annoying to have to look for extensions to download and install. We all know what the average user is like.
Roja wrote:[update]
AKA Panama Jack wrote:
Might be because there are alot of security holes still in Firefox 1.5 and no date as to when they will be fixed.
Firefox fixes security issues faster than most vendors. But, don't forget to mention that Opera also has security issues, and no date for their fix:
http://secunia.com/product/4932/
And again you fail to present both sides of the story.
That site listes one possible security problem and it was reported 2 weeks ago. It is listed as a very low risk. And you claimed that Opera had no mention of a date for their fix. There is a fix out in Opera 9 the next version that can be tested right now (I have been using 9 since it was released in the Beta forums a few weeks ago).
Opera's response
The Technical Preview release of Opera 9.0 displays the form action URL in the status bar, and both the "title" and the action URL in the tooltip. Future releases of Opera will have this behavior.
Original Advisory 2005-11-16:
Opera Image Control Status Bar Spoofing Weakness
Opera's original Response posted a day later and updated a few days later:
http://www.opera.com/support/search/sup ... ?index=819
And you failed to post a link to Firefox's vulnerabilities.
http://secunia.com/product/4227/
You will notice there are 5 security problems with Firefox with the oldest being
OVER ONE YEAR AGO.
Firefox Security Fault 2004-08-30:
Mozilla / Mozilla Firefox Apple Java Plugin Tab Spoofing Vulnerability
Firefox Security Fault 2004-09-18:
Mozilla / Mozilla Firefox Cross-Domain Cookie Injection Vulnerability
Firefox Security Fault 2005-03-01:
Mozilla Firefox Image Javascript URI Dragging Cross-Site Scripting
Firefox Security Fault 2005-05-12:
Mozilla Firefox Download Dialog Spoofing Vulnerabilities
Firefox Security Fault 2005-10-06:
Mozilla Firefox Iframe Size Denial of Service Weakness
As you can see Firefox is lax about keeping on on security holes. Opera does fix them in a timely manner and Opera will even let you know when a new version is availible for downloading.
If you are going to post links for security problems in a rival product you might want to do the same thing for the one you are championing in the effort of equal disclosure.

Posted: Thu Dec 01, 2005 11:20 pm
by Charles256
bam! sorry.hehe