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Posted: Tue Jan 30, 2007 8:17 pm
by AKA Panama Jack
Jenk wrote:
Daedalus- wrote:I don't blame Bill Gates. He just soaks the money up, I think. Wouldn't you? Besides, there are thousands of other people who never have shown an ounce of talent in that company that we can blame for it's problems.
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I don't know...

That is like saying George Bush isn't responsible for the Iraq Debacle.

Remember stupidity starts and the top. :)

And gets compounded as it gets closer to the bottom. ;)

Posted: Tue Jan 30, 2007 8:31 pm
by Jenk
That's not even remotely a close comparison.

__

I don't hate Bill Gates, nor Microsoft.

I dislike the way his company's software operates, and so I choose not to use it where possible.

The rest is envy that it wasn't me in his shoes cashing in on $4million an hour.

Posted: Tue Jan 30, 2007 8:37 pm
by Charles256
Um. I happen to like my copy of Microsoft Vista. Bought at 5 P.M. this afternoon. Did the upgrade, so far it's smooth sailing. Stop the bashing. Please? :-D

Posted: Tue Jan 30, 2007 10:17 pm
by Luke
<-- won't stop the bashing. Microsoft is a monopoly and with every decision they make it seems, they further alienate their advanced users and the developers who make the very software that keeps people buying their products. I hate monopolies and I hate companies who abuse their monopolies. I have no envy for Bill Gates. I'd rather be poor and keep my soul.

:madblow:

Just to be fair, I hate AT&T, Cingular (which is owned by AT&T) and SBC (Which is also owned by AT&T now). That is another monopoly I'd love to burn down.

Posted: Tue Jan 30, 2007 10:18 pm
by feyd
AT&T isn't a monopoly :P

Posted: Tue Jan 30, 2007 10:28 pm
by Luke
Is that so? I hate their service, yet there's nothing I can do about it because there is no competition for them where I live. No other phone companies can give me telephone service. Sounds like a monopoly to me. :?

EDIT: Oh yea they just bought out the only competition they had (SBC). Sounding even more like a monopoly.

Posted: Tue Jan 30, 2007 10:30 pm
by Charles256
sounding more and more like you live in the middle of nowhere ;)

Posted: Tue Jan 30, 2007 10:34 pm
by Luke

Posted: Tue Jan 30, 2007 10:36 pm
by feyd
AT&T can't force you to use their cell services. They also aren't forcing you to use their local phone. There are other providers in the area.. through cable or VOIP, etc...

Posted: Tue Jan 30, 2007 10:40 pm
by Charles256
let's put it this way. i haven't even seen an at&t buiulding in recent memory.. :-D

Posted: Tue Jan 30, 2007 10:45 pm
by Luke
well I realize there are options as far as cellular service goes. I wasn't saying they are a monopoly in the cellular market, but I have no other choice if I want a standard telephone in my home I HAVE to use AT&T. I suppose there are other options such as voip (over cable) so they really aren't a true monopoly, but I still feel like I'm bending over and taking it in the yoohoo.

Posted: Tue Jan 30, 2007 10:49 pm
by RobertGonzalez
I don't know...

That is like saying George Bush isn't responsible for the Iraq Debacle.
Any more politics and this thread gets locked.

Posted: Wed Jan 31, 2007 12:52 am
by matthijs
The Ninja Space Goat wrote:<-- won't stop the bashing. Microsoft is a monopoly and with every decision they make it seems, they further alienate their advanced users and the developers who make the very software that keeps people buying their products. I hate monopolies and I hate companies who abuse their monopolies. I have no envy for Bill Gates. I'd rather be poor and keep my soul.

:madblow:

Just to be fair, I hate AT&T, Cingular (which is owned by AT&T) and SBC (Which is also owned by AT&T now). That is another monopoly I'd love to burn down.
Agreed.

I'm totally fine with people spending their money on products from Microsoft and I'm totally fine if they think Vista is really cool. If that makes them happy, fine.

However, the monopoly Ninja points to makes the market unhealthy. Microsoft can force very bad stuff on us (the "developers"), producers of other hard- and software and on the end users. In practice people do not have a choice. The only choice they have is windows 2000, XP or Vista.

At this moment, most people don't even realize there are other systems. I saw a TV show about vista and the stuff they showed were: fancy moving of windows (wow!), more security (about time), sidebar widgets with weather info etc (mmm.. were have I seen that before ...), tabbed browsing (you guys have to see that, it's so cool), transparent windows (so you can see the reason your machine is running so slow: the other programs running), etc etc

It would be so much better if the market share would be distributed a bit better, like 70/15/15%. It wouldn't have to be 3x30 or 4x25%. If Microsoft stays the biggest fine, if Apple stays around 3-5%, fine. As long as there is a healthier choice and one single producer cannot force everybody to follow their proprietary standards.

I mean, it's not only Microsoft. What Apple is trying to do with iTunes/iPod isn't very good either.

It's only recently that some governments start realizing they have gone along too long. And that they should start using more open formats for their documents, for example. In Belgium, the government is not allowed to distribute info in only Microsoft format anymore. Or they even use only open formats. Think about it: as it is now, as a civilian, you are forced by your own government to buy software from a certain company to be able to access the data you have right to. Or to be able to do stuff, like fill in your taxes, or search for info on a website, etc

Posted: Wed Jan 31, 2007 3:12 am
by Maugrim_The_Reaper
Oh, and many PC professionals are WARNING against doing an upgrade install from XP to Vista. They say you should wipe the hard drive and install everything from scratch because Vista is even worse than XP when it comes to upgrading from a previous OS. You will usually have things that fail to function properly, crashes and unexplained hangs and slowdowns if you use the upgrade option.
Someone noted my own quote as FUD - rightly so since I wasn't specific about which package it referred to - i.e. "Upgrade" packages. Sorry about that...:)

I'll just note that you can "upgrade" using any package, but the "Upgrade Pack" which is cheaper than the non-Upgrade option requires a validated Windows XP install. That is to say, you can only do a clean install if you avoid the "Upgrade" packs. Otherwise you need to install XP, which in my case means I need to retain my ancient Windows 98 disc, validate XP, then upgrade to Vista from within XP. This adds a whole messy process IMO - I'll also need SATA drivers (not supported in the XP install and requires separate loading just before the Installer can kick in) on floppy. Net result is a strong encouragement to avoid the upgrade packs - and given I only heard about this days before the launch (can't believe no one knew this before...) it sounds less like protection and more a marketing strategy. It borders on punishment - I need all three 98/XP/Vista discs for a clean install (which isn't really clean since it needs an XP install).
I mean, it's not only Microsoft. What Apple is trying to do with iTunes/iPod isn't very good either.
Monopolising is not healthy - so while I love Apple as a company iTunes I can't agree with. At the moment not much can be done, Apple has captured the market majority and has the lead. Someone will catch up eventually.
well I realize there are options as far as cellular service goes. I wasn't saying they are a monopoly in the cellular market, but I have no other choice if I want a standard telephone in my home I HAVE to use AT&T. I suppose there are other options such as voip (over cable) so they really aren't a true monopoly, but I still feel like I'm bending over and taking it in the yoohoo.
You should come to Ireland. We have more monopolies than you can shake a stick at. There's only one telephone provider, one electricity provider, two health insurance providers (there were four, but two left after a stupid compensation scheme the main player - now a monopoly - lobbied for, and the fourth is tiny). Ireland is now one of the most expensive countries in Europe to live in - we started calling it "Rip-Off Ireland" over here...

Posted: Wed Jan 31, 2007 3:43 am
by Luke
that's terrible. You're government does nothing to help consumers?