I am considering buying a mac

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Luke
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I am considering buying a mac

Post by Luke »

I have been looking into buying a Mac as my next computer. I'm just looking for advice. I have been a Windows user since I started using computers, but I do not want to make the switch from XP to Vista, and I really don't want to give Microsoft any more money. I'm willing to spend about $1500-2000 on a new machine. If I were to buy one it would probably be in 4-6 months. What I'd like to know is if there are any of you who made the switch from Windows to Mac who have advice for me. What were the difficulties you ran into when making the switch? Are there any potential problems with making the switch (perhaps problems related to being a developer). I'm also looking for advice on what you guys think I should get.

I have a Dell Inspiron 600m w/Windows XP right now and it is my only computer. I am not a gamer in the least. Up until recently, all I did on my computer was web development. Lately I've been into FL Studio (Fruity Loops) and also animation, which has made me realize I need a new computer. So that's what I'll be doing with the new computer... video / audio editing and web development / programming.
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Kieran Huggins
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Post by Kieran Huggins »

If I were buying new equipment now, I think I would either get the black MacBook or one of the MacBook Pros form the refurb store:
http://store.apple.com/1-800-MY-APPLE/W ... rtifiedMac

The 17" Pro is tempting (especially with that discount!) but portability is a huge deal as well, and those smaller MacBooks are pretty sweet in that regard. An external monitor solves that issue anyway.

I'd pair said laptop with a 24" Dell WFP2407-HC (cheap, good, lots of USB & card reader) and a good keyboard at home, and a Logitech bluetooth mouse for both home and the road (hate trackpads). Oh, and as much after-market memory as I could cram in to it - memory is cheap when you don't buy it from Apple!

I've moved all my storage drives into a cheap media PC in the living room (along with my torrent client) so my desktop machine doesn't need much in it.

Alas, I have no excuse for new stuff anytime soon *sniff*, but I too think my next machine will be a Mac. Possibly the one mentioned above (or whatever happens to be current).

The black refurb MacBook + RAM + Dell monitor should run you just about 2K.
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Benjamin
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Post by Benjamin »

I have honestly been tempted to buy a mac as well. After considering it, I realized that it was more cost effective and beneficial to me as a developer to just get a regular PC and put Linux on it. Linux is my operating system of choice but I keep windows around dual boot for convenience. There are times when I need to test a layout in IE or run software on Windows that won't run in Linux. As for the latter, I'm down to one, which actually does run on Linux but it creates licensing headaches.
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Maugrim_The_Reaper
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Post by Maugrim_The_Reaper »

Another wannabe MacBook owner here ;).

I'm looking to replace my laptop which is loaded with XP at present. I use Linux (Ubuntu and Fedora) on a dual booting PC and but I'd prefer the laptop to go with something a little more stylish and standardised. I travel around a lot and XP has survived so far since it require little maintenance (or my idea of maintainance for Linux ;)).

My preferred choice would be a slim 13" MacBook, after the November model update being rumoured. So long as I can plugin in a keyboard and adapt to a monitor that's really sufficient for anything I'd use it for. I am completely certain I am not interested in Windows - Vista is almost scary in how ignorant it seems to act. And on a dual core machine it still has some pitiful performance for some operations. I'm glad I got it on the cheap.

Being portable is a major need - so no MacBook Pro for me. Buying Vista again is never going to happen. Need a known well-behaving development environment. Having some decent tools for audio and image editing a big plus. Dependable and a good support package for repairs also a big plus.
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Post by alex.barylski »

Vista is really that bad eh?

I still prefer XP over Ubuntu for most of everything I do...but if Vista really sucks that bad...maybe I'll switch over to Ubuntu and just live with it.
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Kieran Huggins
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Post by Kieran Huggins »

Got a Dell catalog in the mail today, their 22" 1680x1050 monitors are on sale for $269 v.s. the 24" 1920x1080 for $750. That's a big price difference to be sure! You can often find the 24" version for $500 US, but it's still twice the price.

It's personally worth it for me, but it makes the call that much more difficult.

I think I'd have to agree that the 13.3" MacBook is the better choice travel-wise, and there's a hardware revision rumor floating around.

Damn this urge to Macify! I was planning to buy a new 24mm 1.4 L for my 30d, but now I'm all conflicted.
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Post by pickle »

I was raised on Macs, then went to Windows for about 5 years, now I'm back to Mac. The only difficulties I had were that none of my games work. You not being a gamer though - it shouldn't be an issue for you. Development used to be an issue until I discovered Coda. Its' not free, but I like it better than BBEdit.

I can't think of any reason not to go to a Mac, other than you won't natively have an instance of IE to test on. It's pretty simple though to throw on a partition of Windows XP, then use Fusion to check stuff in IE - without having to reboot.

I personally hate laptops, but I realize I'm in the minority here - go for one of them if you want, but I'd personally go for the iMac if I was only spending $2K.
Real programmers don't comment their code. If it was hard to write, it should be hard to understand.
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Maugrim_The_Reaper
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Post by Maugrim_The_Reaper »

To Hockey. It's not completely terrible - but there are dozens of small quirks which in isolation are minor, but collectively are plain annoying. XP might not have all the fancy eye candy, but it's predictable and has no such quirks. I honestly don't see where all their development money went to. I'll keep Vista around since I am a gamer - but otherwise XP was the biz for Windows.

Yes, the reasoning for a 13.3" MacBook is travel.
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The Phoenix
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Re: I am considering buying a mac

Post by The Phoenix »

The Ninja Space Goat wrote:What I'd like to know is if there are any of you who made the switch from Windows to Mac who have advice for me. What were the difficulties you ran into when making the switch? Are there any potential problems with making the switch (perhaps problems related to being a developer). I'm also looking for advice on what you guys think I should get.
I made the switch a few months back for my job. I decided before I even started that I wanted a quality interface that got out of my way, and just let me shell and email. The rest was just icing on the cake.

I ran into a few annoyances when I switched.

First and foremost is the paradigm shift. In Windows, a "Window" is related to an application. When the application is done (closed), and the window closes, the process shuts down. In OS X, the OS is "document" focused. So, if you open a document, and then close it, the application stays open. Its a poor argument, because many non-document-based applications just stay open. For example, terminal, itunes, and so forth. OS X just likes leaving applications running. If - IF - you can ignore that, its actually fairly nice. On my 2gb macbook, its still very snappy at the end of the day, but I still have mental issues with applications staying open. Notably, there is an application that helps with this - stoplight. Unfortunately, it causes bigger problems, like having to logout/shutdown twice. Yes, really. :(

Second, there is no delete, and there is no insert. Oh, there is a key NAMED delete, but its actually backspace. You might actually get tempted to use the delete functionality that is available with a modifier key, but its inconsistent from application to application. Annoyingly inconsistent. But insert is absolutely not there. There isn't a key for it on the keyboard, and even if you plug in a usb keyboard that has one, it doesn't map to anything - because OS X doesn't "do" insert. Its obnoxious. For me, this one is the real killer because I lost shift-delete/shift-insert for cut/paste. Again, you'd be tempted to use the OS X version: CMD-C/CMD-V. Only, yup, its inconsistent in many applications too. Worse, thats *copy*, not cut. I haven't found a consistent cut/paste in OS X. Its incredibly limiting.

Further on that note, my favorite key-strokes (like control-e for end of line) is actually cmd-e, and alt-tabbing does not do what you expect it to based on Windows or Linux behavior. Its extremely frustrating how it handles application switching, which is yet again based on their document-centered experience. Thats fine and all, if you are primarily document based. I'm not.

Third, it is very difficult to turn off the startup chime. There are third-party mods that let you, but I've had terrible luck with them. This might seem like no big deal, but when you go to start your computer at a lecture, conference, meeting, or while your daughter takes a nap on your lap - you will be cursing Apple for their rigidity.

Mail.app is pretty good, very nice fonts, incredibly solid performance. However, it doesn't handle imap very nicely, and the search is hit-or-miss. I'm not positive why, but I always feel like it is the best *looking* mail client I've ever used, but it feels lacking technically. Really can't be specific about it. :(

The lack of right-click "new document" choices is a bit annoying. I got spoiled having those, and I admit, its a nice feature. OS X doesn't have it by default. Select/Paste via mouse also is inconsistent in areas. Some applications (iTerm) allow you to use center mouse-button click to dump text. Others force it to right click, and a menu option. Some don't give the mouse that ability at all. Selecting is similar. Some applications let you select with the mouse, and its copied. Some require a context menu choice. Yet others force you to go to the main window, choose edit, and copy.

If you couldn't tell, I'm seriously considering a switch away from Macs. Its a shame, because for 90% of my workload, it is an amazingly comfortable machine with absolutely no problems.

There are some things I will miss, that you will LOVE on OS X. iTerm is absolutely amazing. Transparency, moving shells from one window to another, sending output to multiple windows at the same time, saving scripted logins, and so much more makes iTerm one of the absolutely best terminal programs I've ever used. Setup is a bit of a pain, but once setup, its beautiful. Putty doesn't even come close , and SecureCRT is just ugly (but nearly as functional, and likely to be my choice on Windows)

iTunes & my iPhone obviously work great in every part of OS X, from calendar to address book, and its only going to get better in Leopard, so I'm going to be sad to see that go.

Parallels & Coherence is absolutely great - if you can get your copy of Windows working in it. I had three *legit* versions of XP, including one brand-new, in the box. Only one of them worked all the way through the install process. No idea why, but the forums are full of similar complaints. Once I got it setup, it launches Windows applications as if I'm running Windows. I'm able to run my daughters favorite games, including lots of Dora. I can even run Balders Gate collection, and a few others.

Gaming on OS X is admittedly behind the PC a bit, but lately, most of the games I've wanted to play have been available for it shortly after the PC launch. I'm almost never a "release day" gamer, so it doesn't impact me much. Lots of studios (EA, etc) are coming around on the merits of OS X, so that isn't too bad.

All in all, it was mostly what I expected, although the paradigm changes and the key changes frustrate me enough to switch back. If you can live with those, its an amazing machine.

As to what to get, the macbook is nice on size and style, but I really hate the tiny screen. I'd buy a macbook pro for myself if money wasn't an issue, and I hadn't experienced the annoyances I have.
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Post by RobertGonzalez »

I want one. My wife is on board with me. Regardless of the transition issues, when we buy our next computers we are all (yes, the kids too) going mac. Then I am going to turn all the PCs in the house into Linux machines.

I say go for it. Transitions be damned, go for it!
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Luke
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Post by Luke »

Wow, thanks everybody! :)
I can't think of any reason not to go to a Mac, other than you won't natively have an instance of IE to test on. It's pretty simple though to throw on a partition of Windows XP, then use Fusion to check stuff in IE - without having to reboot.
eh, that's what my old laptop is for. :)

The Phoenix - thanks for such a thorough review! :-D
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Post by Kieran Huggins »

Phoenix reflects all my keyboard fears :? which are my biggest fears of the switch.

That being said, when you watch things like Railscasts or other TextMate demos, people fly around documents with ease. I imagine it's just a matter of learning the "Apple way" and diving in head-first.

The IMAP issues are news to me, and potentially scary.... hopefully leopard will solve them on Thursday.
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Post by JAB Creations »

I've got a Mac; eh, it's ok...
Image

Then I got a spiffy new case, a heatsink for my extra CPU, some memory for an old 939 AGP board, and moved my PC in to a more desirable residence...
http://www.jabcreations.com/temp/new_pics/
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Post by toasty2 »

I think you don't get much for your money with Macs, the only reason to buy one is for the OS. Building your own computer is much better, you build it how you want it and get a much better deal. I'd stick a Linux distro on it.
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Kieran Huggins
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Post by Kieran Huggins »

Wow - Jonny must have been on vacation that week 8O
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